Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Discussion of Transmission that doesn't fit in the other categories
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Zeviet
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 6:17 pm

Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Zeviet »

Hi,

I have a lot of torrents downloading, 86. I'm running a mac pro. I have the newest version of transmission and port is open, with more seeders than leachers. My downloads are only going at 5-10kb and my when I try surfing the web it doesn't load until I quit Transmission. If someone could help me, Thanks!
Jordan
Transmission Developer
Posts: 2312
Joined: Sat May 26, 2007 3:39 pm
Location: Titania's Room

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Jordan »

So, possibly two issues here -- slow downloads speeds, and slow surfing.

About the slow speeds, Transmission has a checklist of some of the common culprits for slow speeds. You may want to work your way through the checklist: http://trac.transmissionbt.com/wiki/SlowSpeeds

About the slow surfing, the most likely cause is if your router is getting overloaded with peer connections. This can happen much more easily on some routers than others. One way to test this theory is to go into the preferences dialog and keep reducing the maximum number of peers allowed by Transmission. (Note: once your router is overloaded, reducing this number won't help instantly. You'll need to either wait quite a long time for the router to timeout the excess connections, or do what most people do and reboot the router.)
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

I had this problem too and worked through your list, which I found useful, thanks. However, the suggestion of reducing the number of peers just seemed to make it worse for me - although I know my router has been swamped because it falls over every so often. What I did was change the peer listening port, under Transmission>Preferences>Network: to a different port number, and then mapped it again so it was port forwarding. Then signed back on (re-enabled from pause), and it seemed to work much better again after the rather laborious initialisation phase.

Reducing the peer numbers and rebooting the router seemed to help for a short while, but then it seemed to fall back into crawl mode. Changing the peer listening port number seems to have cleared it up for me at the moment. Its been running at healthy exchange speeds since I did that anyway - about four hours ago. Oh, I'm seeding at the moment and its an 8 gigabyte file, so I just want it done.

I had similar problems when downloading, where it would run at pretty good speeds for long periods and then drop to crawl or my router would fall-off when I wasn't watching. Crashed Safari and reduced internet page loading speeds to ages too, even when Transmission was slowed right down. No crash report for Transmission, but I forwarded the Safari crash reports to Apple using the auto-report function a few times.

Cheers
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

I've had a stab at a bug report for you. Sorry if its in the wrong place, but it does relate to this thread. I hope some of my comments are of some use.

Cheers

=======================================================================================================================

Not Downloading, Slow Internet Bug

1. Read the Forum Rules First.
done.
2. Test out a nightly build and see if the problem's already been fixed.
not done.
3. Say what version of Transmission you're using, and on what operating system.
Transmission 1.74. Operating System: Mac OS X v.10.5.6. Belkin F5D7632-4 (used in wireless mode with Macbook Pro Airport connection).
4. Post a Recipe, if possible:
Download/Upload 1 x 8 gigabyte file. Only torrent running. Speed progressively collapses to crawl mode 1-3 kb/s and stays there. Download speed set: unlimited. Upload speed: when downloading I found I could only get reliable exchange speeds when set to 20 kb/s upload speed, and this only for a couple of hours before it progressively began to download below. Lowering the settings triggers a race to the bottom with the download speed constantly re-adjusting just a bit below. Offering unlimited upload speed made no difference. On ulpoad - seeding after I’d got the file - same problem, progressively slower until crawling or stalled. Worked through the list and re-booted router with reduced peer connection numbers, as suggested, this eventually produced a stall response at:

Global Maximum peer connections: 100
Max for new transfers: 30

Reset peer connections to defaults (200:60). Paused, rebooted router, changed peer listening port number and re-mapped port to engage port forwarding. Been running at okay exchange upload speeds for 11 hours now, without crashing my router when I need food or sleep, etc. 

No longer crashing Safari, but page loading speeds are still dire. Safari crash reports sent to Apple.

5. If you're experiencing slow speeds
The wiki has a good guide for troubleshooting slow speeds. It will likely help solve your problem, so read through it first.

Done. It didn’t, though I found it helpful, thanks. Problem partially solved as described in 4., and with Transmission paused I’ve tested Safari internet access and page-loading speeds okay, so I think when I’ve finished seeding and no longer running Transmission that will be okay.

1. Do you have any per-torrent or global speed limits set? No: global both unlimited
2. What are your global and per-torrent peer limits? default 200:60
3. How many seeds and peers does the `Peers' tab say there are in the swarm? This has varied, but average seed number was 90-100 and average download peers 300.
4. How long ago does the `Tracker' tab say the last announce and scrape results were? I wasn’t monitoring this when I was having problems, but in inspector>peers window> connections line information: trackers were shown both connected and not connected when crawl mode present, at different times. I didn’t see any problem announcements from the trackers when working through your list.
5. In the `Tracker' tab's list of trackers, how many Tiers are there, and how many trackers are listed for each tier?
6. How many peers are you connected to? When it was knocking my router over it was regularly up to 60, as per my limit setting (default) at that time. I’ve not seen it go over 42 since I re-allocated the port number and its been running okay for more than 11 hours now - I’m still set to 60 so the tracker has lowered its setting.
7. Has your torrent finished downloading? Yes, and I’m at 92% seeding so nearly done.
8. If you're still downloading, do any of the connected peers have a higher "completed" percentage than you? N/A.
9. Is your incoming peer port open or closed? Open, but you need to keep an eye on this because knocking your router over sometimes closes it again and it can’t find the port look-up page, saying: 2009-09-03 20:07:28 +0100 net.c:341 [Error] Transmission: Couldn't connect socket 35 to 255.255.255.255, port 39426 (errno 13 - Permission denied). By whom, it doesn’t say. I turned lighthouse off:on, re-numbered the peer listening port, re-mapped it, then reconnected and its running okay. I have to leave the preferences window open and toggle in and out of the network window to check the port is still forwarded periodically, but it seems stable now. Putting a repeater “port is open/closed” light in the main Transmission window would be useful here, less clutter on the desktop if I could close the preferences window and still monitor port forwarding status. Just a thought.

6. The 'Peers' and 'Tracker' tabs are in the dialog named "Inspector" on the Mac GUI and "Torrent Properties" on the GTK+ GUI. Thanks.

7. If Transmission crashed on the Mac.
Transmission didn’t crash, thankfully, or trash the downloaded data files (unlike xTorrent), for which I’m truly grateful, thanks. It was causing Safari to crash before I re-numbered the port, although Lighthouse didn’t detect any conflict on the default port number. 

9. If it's a Port Mapping Error.
I only got this after the router was knocked over and I’ve reported above Transmission’s logged coment when re-enabling after sorting things out.
=======================================================================================================================

Update 1

After 14 hr 35 min router crashed again - confirmed by Lighthouse error log. Hung it out the window for 5 minutes to cool it down - poor ventilation and thermal management as designed. Had to re-boot it a couple of times because it wouldn't pick-up the internet connection again until I'd cooled it off a bit first. Port remained forwarded okay this time so I didn't bother changing the port number again just yet. Nothing logged for Transmission in messages or crash file. On resuming after successful router reboot normal speeds immediately. 22 leeches connected directly - 21 PEX, 1 DHT - no Tracker. Globally, 83 seeds, 301 leeches. Tracker Announce and scrape both fail when down - successful when back up. 0.98% seeded - so not too long now. If you have any questions either email me or post something here. I'll probably pop back to check.

Both the MacBook Pro and the Router run hot when port forwarded - the Mac has built in force ventilation so superior heat management, but I give it some help by heat-sinking on my marble (or imitation marble) fireplace. Unfortunately the router is upstairs - that's why I hang it out the window when it overheats - if it's not raining, of course. I don't suppose the router components are mil-spec so thermal ranges will vary widely. Don't know about the Mac - it cost enough so maybe they are mil-spec components.

Cheers

================================================================================================================================================

Update 2

All done. No more incidents. Speeds remained good until seeding completed. Safari page-loading access is back to normal speeds now that I've turned transmission and lighthouse off. You may only get some of the above problems when downloading big files for sustained periods, and desktops tend to have better cooling than laptops. I'd guess it would be difficult to replicate some of these problems with different hardware platforms that have inherently superior thermal management by design. I hope the feedback has been useful.

Cheers

================================================================================================================================================

One other point is that you get far better bandwidth hard-wired to the router and the MacBook and router power overhead is lower, so probably less thermal saturation on long downloads and better speeds than wireless through Airport. I'm that used to using the Mac wireless I suppose I just forgot about bandwidth and overhead. Anyway, it's something else you can try if you find things are running hot on long torrent downloads.

Cheers
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

Conclusion: hardware thermal saturation

I suppose I should clarify some of the above reported problems to help others who experience the same problem. The problem I've described above was 'thermal saturation' of the hardware I was using and is not, I believe, a specifically software problem for transmission. Using a laptop, MacBook Pro, in wireless mode coupled with a wireless router for a big file download (or a lot of files) causes thermal saturation for the hardware - mainly the router but the MacBook heats up too.

All electronic components have a limited temperature working range, there's a 'bathtub curve' for component yields predicted mortality based on post-production heat-soak thermal tests. Military specification (mil-spec) components are subjected to long post-production heat-soak tests that destroys a high proportion of them, reducing yield, increasing the cost of each component, but offering higher performance reliability and wider temperature operational ranges for those that survive. That makes mil-spec components much more expensive than non-mil spec because of both higher reliability and far less prone to 'infant mortality' - the term for component failure in early working life. Components that are not heat-soak tested post production are a lot cheaper, prone to early life failure - infant mortality - and far more susceptible to temperature fluctuations and therefore have much more limited reliable working temperature ranges. Outside of their working temperature range they can suffer infant mortality failures or exhibit unreliable performance characteristics. As such, hardware designers using non-mil spec components usually need to incorporate some form of active heat management (a fan) to ensure components remain within reliable working ranges. Of course, it's cheaper to just plastic-mold a cheap case with some holes in it and rely on air circulation to dissipate latent heat that builds up in components crowded together on an electronics card or pcb. Build up of latent heat is proportional to work load of the components themselves, amongst other things such as component layout and effective heat-sinking of components designed to run hot for better performance.

The performance drop-off, in terms of reduced download/upload file kb/s rates, that I described above are coincident with the effects of thermal saturation, or latent heat build-up, mainly in the router I was using. The principal cause, I believe, was continuous running in wireless mode for long periods. This increases the workload of components both in the router and the MacBook, which increases heat losses and latent heat build-up if the heat losses are not actively managed - forced ventilated by a fan and effective heat-sinks on specific components. This can cause the router to hang or crash when it becomes saturated with heat and its overall performance deteriorates progressively as the latent heat builds up in it over time when downloading/uploading a big file, for example.

Hard-wiring the MacBook to the router should significantly reduce the effects of latent heat build-up in both the router and MacBook. You'll get far better upload/download files exchange speeds hard-wired because of the increased bandwidth, and the processing overhead and associated heat losses that wireless mode Airport operation produces will be significantly reduced, greatly reducing the build-up of latent heat in both pieces of hardware. Most desktop users are probably still hard-wired so they are far less likely to experience the problem I've described. Other things you can do to reduce processing overhead are, limit the number of other applications running at the same time - particularly if they have router throughput. You can also help manage heat losses by ensuring the MacBook and router are operating in a well ventilated area, or help sink the heat by placing them on a cold surface that has large mass - this will help to absorb reflected heat and sink it. You'll notice the MacBook fan switch off and it running much cooler on a good cold surface that has substantial mass.

Cheers
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

Second Run - 5.8GB file, so not quite as optimistic. Off to a pretty slow start with no thermal saturation issues. Port open and hard-wired. I swapped ports a few times early on but it made no difference. Low DL rates at the beginning - 0.07KB/s up to 1.5KB/s and meandering around these low levels for some hours whilst quoting around 56 days to download the file. Broadband speeds tested okay - around 2.8 - 3.0 MB, which is average for my current ISP. Stayed at these low speeds for about 2 hr 18m, when I got a quick busrt of average 50 KB/s then one second or so at 100 KBs then back to crawl. No UL until 4 hr 22m. So off to a pretty slow start but speeds did normalise after this. No thermal issues during early running with better peak speeds, due hard wired, and improved stability when cycling both UL and DL. I'll post a bit more later, but 0.7KB/s is a commitment test for a 5.8 GB file that I'd guess most people will pass on.
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

Just a quick follow-up note. On the second day of this second run I found my router had dropped off again over night, so I could buy a new one or fix this one. I thought I'd have no guarantee that a new one would have any better thermal performance or constant duty cycle, so I decided to fix mine. This meant a series of heat-runs, where key temperature variables are monitored.

First set of tests, as is, to get benchmark performance data - stand-up time for continuous use and peak exhaust vent temperatures. Second set of tests - no lid - to monitor key component temperatures and 'free-air' running temperatures. Third set of tests were to monitor thermal performance of various air-flow modifications to the case, against benchmark data. It took some time because I didn't have any data-loggers so had to take hourly spot readings with k type thermocouples, and some continuous readings for peak detect of key temperatures. It was a bit tedious and took a little longer to cure continuous running thermal issues with my router than I'd hoped.

I've made substantial modifications to the case to improve air-flow: mainly extra draw holes drilled in the base of the case adjacent to the pcb to provide air-flow for component cooling, and I've fitted a chimney to the top cover to draw air through the components. Running temperatures are now excellent, but I've probably over-killed the problem a bit. I wont have any more self-saturation trips from this router. But I'm still getting loss of service trips - this could be ISP discontinuity, or some other problem. No fault logs that I can find and my router tried to sign back on, which it wasn't doing before when it overheated.

On the continuous thermal duty of my router before modification - all I can say is that it was very poor, around 15 hours to self-saturate with maximum exhaust temperature of 36 degrees C, against a background ambient of 18 degrees C.

I'm 63% through this second run. Now I'm not messing about with heat runs for my router I'll keep an eye on it and see what else pops up.

Cheers
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

Further observations:

Don't know if this is related to the network drop-off problem but a bunch of organisations are trying to strike up stealth mode port connections to my computer whilst I'm downloading this file - from the following IPs:

Sep 9 10:35:28 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:57358 from 92.123.189.15:80

Sep 10 07:33:48 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63820 from 217.12.8.220:80

Sep 10 07:33:36 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63821 from 63.241.108.124:80

Sep 10 07:33:36 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63820 from 217.12.8.220:80

Sep 10 07:33:27 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63820 from 217.12.8.220:80

Sep 10 07:33:27 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63821 from 63.241.108.124:80

Sep 10 07:33:27 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63822 from 217.146.179.205:80

Sep 10 07:33:30 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63821 from 63.241.108.124:80

Sep 10 07:33:30 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63820 from 217.12.8.220:80

Sep 10 07:57:05 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63988 from 209.85.229.105:80

Sep 10 07:57:07 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63988 from 209.85.229.105:80

Sep 10 07:57:14 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:63988 from 209.85.229.105:80

Sep 10 07:58:02 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64001 from 209.85.229.105:80

If you look them up they're registered to Google, Yahoo, and Akamai Technologies (who do the Whitehouse Computers for President Obama : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akamai_Technologies ). The sudden popularity of my computer may account for some of the connection failures. Are other Transmission users getting the same kind of attention?

Cheers
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

And a few others too:

Sep 10 08:40:22 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64351 from 213.123.84.246:80

Sep 10 08:40:22 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64352 from 217.163.21.36:80

Sep 10 08:40:22 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64353 from 217.146.179.205:80

Sep 10 08:40:23 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64351 from 213.123.84.246:80

Sep 10 08:40:23 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64352 from 217.163.21.36:80

Sep 10 08:40:23 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64353 from 217.146.179.205:80

Sep 10 08:40:25 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64352 from 217.163.21.36:80

Sep 10 08:40:26 Macintosh-2 Firewall[41]: Stealth Mode connection attempt to TCP 192.168.2.2:64351 from 213.123.84.246:80

They must think there's something interesting on my computer. They're going to be disappointed if they do get through the firewall. :(

Cheers
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

The problem that |'m now getting relates to the tracker getting ahead as reported in this thread: http://forum.transmissionbt.com/viewtop ... f=1&t=8624
Once in this position, if you set your upload rate to zero - in line with a 1:1 parity ratio - the tracker progressively reduces download until it stalls. Currently, I'm at 94.67% of the file and when I sign on the tracker downloads nothing. I don't know if this is a transmission bug or a problem with the tracker or if I'm not doing something I should be or doing something I shouldn't. All I do know is that downloading has stalled completely. When it did this yesterday I swapped ports 20 - 30 times and eventually it started downloading again. When I verify data, it only verifies part of the data it acknowledges as downloaded (have 5.5 GB only verifies 4.85 GB) with no explanation as to what is wrong with the rest of the data or why it won't check it. 0 failed bytes.

At the fourth sign on it has started occasional bursts of 8 kb/s DL, so it might start again after all. All earlier attempts produced no DL output with seeders appearing in the peers window but seemingly unable to communicate at all. This is similar to yesterday where short bursts had progressively larger gaps of total inactivity - stalled - between them until it was doing nothing.
Pete99
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:50 am

Re: Not Downloading, Slow Internet

Post by Pete99 »

Thanks for that, I suspected that it was something like that but I didn't know what, exactly. Anyway, it finished off DL pretty well okay this morning, without the wrinkly-eyed spaghetti-western stand-offs, before the shooting starts. I did have an external line interrupt - not just loss of my internet connection but loss of the telephone line as well. It didn't last long, but it was enough to stall proceedings at a tantalising 99.87% completion. My router is running really cool against a background ambient of 18 deg C, so I know its not having any thermal rating issues at all. The top-hat chimney-pot mod makes it the QE2 of the router world and it runs continuously cool, no matter how busy it gets.

I did have one further Safari crash last night and sent the auto-bug-report to Apple. Nothing in the messages window for transmission and no crash logs - except for Safari. The only thing I could find this morning around the time-stamp for the external line interrupt was:

11/09/2009 08:24:46 mDNSResponder[24] setsockopt - IP_MULTICAST_IF error 169.254.125.248 -1 errno 49 (Can't assign requested address)

which might mean something to someone, or it may not be related. I don't know.

The only other observation I have relates to the statistical data in Inspector>Activity (Transfer) window. Its showing that I have 5.8 GB (verified), but that I've only downloaded 4.85 GB. Can't be right, because I've got the 5.8 GB file and Transmission knows it, because its verified it.

Thanks again for the feedback.

Cheers
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